|
Post by paforrest on May 30, 2017 13:43:23 GMT -5
I've asked someone who went to PurCon if there were questions asked about Rowena. She said that Ruth was very dissapointed, she (Ruth) said she wasn't asked or told beforehand about Rowena's death. Ruth had a German translation with her and she repeated that a couple of times. The other actors didn't know what it meant. My friend knows what the tranalation said but she hasn't told me yet. Ruth refused to answer questions about Rowena's future. Ruth finally broke and retorted with Yeah she got roasted by Lucifer. It really feels to me like Ruth became collateral damage on the heels of whatever went down between Mark and TPTB. Obviously Dabb and Singer decided to cut all ties with Crowley's story, which meant screwing over Ruth and eliminating her character in such a tacky manner. Disgusting. As is Travis in his apparently never-ending vendetta against the Js, but especially Jensen, for whatever happened with TPTB's decision to no longer pursue his character on the series. It seems he also blames his own creepy behavior on the Js, or Jensen, that caused Creation to cut ties with him. The fact that he still follows what's happening on the show and in the fandom is very stalkery and worrisome.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 29, 2017 9:42:06 GMT -5
CW TV shows 2016-17 18-49 Yr-to-yr demo change Viewers (millions) change 1 The Flash (renewed) 1.06 -22.75% 2.840 -19.58% 2 Supergirl (renewed) 0.72 -56.90% 2.356 -69.34% 3 DC's Legends of Tom. (renewed)0.64 -20.37% 1.810 -16.50% 4 Arrow (renewed) 0.62 -34.51% 1.755 -29.48% 5 Supernatural (renewed) 0.60 -14.60% 1.675 -5.61% 6 Riverdale (renewed) 0.39 1.042 7 The Vampire Diaries (ended) 0.38 -17.39% 0.993 -13.22% 8 Jane the Virgin (renewed) 0.35 -6.62% 0.957 0.25% 9 The 100 (renewed) 0.34 -30.13% 0.955 -27.99% 10 iZombie (renewed) 0.33 -38.44% 0.909 -31.63% 11 The Originals (renewed) 0.32 -16.67% 0.943 1.32% 12 Frequency (cancelled) 0.27 0.936 13 No Tomorrow (cancelled) 0.26 0.794 14 Terry Crews Saves Christmas 0.24 0.735 15 Reign (ending) 0.21 -31.31% 0.694 -28.46% 16 Crazy Ex-Girlfriend (renewed) 0.20 -31.79% 0.556 -36.04% Ratings © 2017 The Nielsen Company. All Rights Reserved. tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/cw-2016-17-season-ratings/ Interesting stats. Thanks, paro.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 28, 2017 6:40:15 GMT -5
The best part is how bad they are at this. Don't lie if there's a high chance of being caught out or called out. People you unceremoniously got rid of aren't going to play along with it reliably and then you definitely look like a jackass. That's what baffles me the most to be honest. I'm starting to get a bad feeling, like they're all in "show on his last legs" mode and don't pay any attention anymore. Because they really went in with the social media thing, so I don't think it's a case of not knowing how quickly things can backfire on you... I mean, like I tweeted once to cw and dabb, there *is* such a thing as bad publicity now, and your show trending on twitter is not a good thing if a whole lot of thiese tweets are full of "the reason you suck". I do think they didn't expect Mark to be so open about it but still, if you know that something went wrong, don't go poking the bear! Maybe someone should remind them that for people liable to follow them ,or not, in future endeavors, there's a big difference between a show ending on his terms and with a bang, and a show either canceled or ending in an angry clusterfuck full of bitter and/or enraged fans. Okay, loving that "TPTB Starter Pack"! LOL! So much BURN, so little life to enjoy it all. Heh-heh-heh. And this is Trump Administration level stupid for Singer, Dabb, et. al. not to know that Mark Sheppard wouldn't go quietly into that good night after being screwed over by them, especially after much quieter actors have thrown shade before. These people are even more unqualified to be in their positions that I already thought they were. I agree, they're in "last legs" mode, they don't care - clearly they don't care - and now it's almost like they're going out of their way to try and f-up the show. And, no, I will have no desire to follow Andrew Dabb in any of his future screw ups, er, endeavors.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 26, 2017 5:45:26 GMT -5
It's cool. FYI, Andrew Dabb is now officially snowflaking:
Some of the Dean gifs in response are hilarious. FFS.... Seriously, does Dabb have any redeemning qualities? What kind of reaction was he expecting after that clusterfuck of a season and a finale? That people would be in awe of his "vision" (and I use the term loosely...) And what the hell happened to Berens? Berens turned out to be an epic follower and became Dabb's creature in season 11, happily hopped on the Dean!Who/Dean!Sucks train, and subsequently lost every ounce of talent he may have had. Dabb is apparently kryptonite against writing talent and common sense.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 25, 2017 6:25:10 GMT -5
Dabb & Singer might be just dandy with writing out Dean, but the network execs know perfectly well that would kill the show. So, don't expect that to happen any time soon. Singer might not care either way, but if Dabb could fire Jensen he would, that much is clear now. The only reason he doesn't is because the network and studio are very aware that the show needs Jensen Ackles, so they won't let him. But that realization isn't going to be enough to make Dabb give a shit about writing for Dean - that much is also clear from season 12. So unless the CW or WB step in to demand a showrunner change, season 13 is going to be much of the same, if not worse than season 12. I'm waiting to see if Mark Sheppard is going to air all the dirty laundry at one of the 2017 Creation cons now that he took a flamethrower to the bridges.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 25, 2017 6:02:30 GMT -5
Saw that exchange between Mark and Jim last night, and, wow, the flames from those burning bridges are HOT! Whatever happened really sounds a whole helluva lot worse than I had originally imagined.
Then there's him breaking off with Creation on top of all this, finishing out his 2017 contracts and saying buh-bye! to anything after that.
With Mark having zero fucks left to give, and him appearing in all the 2017 Creation cons to the end of the year, I'd be shocked if something isn't said or doesn't come out from his talks at those cons, certainly in one or more of his M&Gs, at the very least.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 21, 2017 8:24:51 GMT -5
OR real Cas is dead, and Misha will play alt!Cas from now on. For Cas, that's actually my worst case scenario. But I'm sure Dabb would love it, because Alt!Cas would mean a total reset of relationships, he can make him AllAboutSam and have yet something else he can take away from Dean's character. ...... I'm not really excited about Alt!anything to be honest. Unless TPTB give Dabb adult supervision, I don't expect S13 to be any better and Jensen is not enough anymore to keep me on board. PrettyWallPaperDean as a storyline doesn't do a thing for me, SammyKin TheWonderTrickPony is really getting on my last nerves, and Cas character has been such a mess that I wasn't even saddened by his death. Maybe the summer will calm things down, but right now I'm kissing S13 goodbye. Well, yeah, I admit there's a damn good chance that Dabb wants to go with an alt!Cas so he can eliminate yet another thing that was Dean's - his relationship with Cas. And as season 12 proved, every time Dabb and his talentless crew of hacks take something from Dean, it's so they can give it to Sam. And if that happens with Cas, there's no question the character instantly becomes odious to me. So, no, I honestly don't expect season 13 to be any good, not with Singer and Dabb still running the show and the CW not caring about making any changes. The only episode that actually might be good is the Scooby Doo crossover, ironically - and the reason for that is because it's being written by a couple of animation writers and not by anyone on the SPN staff. Yeah, it is getting increasingly harder to stick around for Jensen/Dean, as I have been doing for years, because his character is being systematically destroyed by Dabb et. al. I do think Jensen still tries with whatever horrible material he's given - if he's given anything, which honestly isn't hardly anything anymore. But he can only do so much, and I also think he's past trying to fight for Dean the way he used to.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 20, 2017 17:39:38 GMT -5
I'm going to post my thoughts here since I can dump on both episodes at once. I wasn't going to watch the night the episodes aired because I haven't been watching live; but at the last minute a pal said she wanted to come over with wine and we'd drink and power through it together. So I said, WTF, come on over. How bad can it be if we're sloshed? There is no amount of alcohol in the world to make what I saw Thursday night go down any better. I even forced myself - and I do mean FORCED - to go back and watch all the parts I ignored a second time on Friday. And while the best thing I can say is that Jensen, naturally, knocked it out of the park in 22, the "saving mommy" material he was given didn't resonate with me at all. I mean, 12:22 was the episode Jensen liked?!?!? Has he given up so completely - and my feeling is that he has to an extent - that just because Dean finally got to use the grenade launcher, he was content enough? Because I can't see any other reason he'd have liked this episode. Again, yes, he had all the emo stuff with Mary, and Jensen is very very good with those scenes and he knows it. But normally the emo stuff isn't what stands out as a factor he loves in any given episode. So I still think it was the stupid grenade launcher - which was cool - and the little bit of fight he got with Ketch at the end that he liked. Yeah, good, but not enough of it. Speaking of Ketch, when he was pointing the gun at Dean, and you knew Mary would come up behind him and kill Ketch before he could kill Dean - SADLY - I was literally screaming at the TV for Ketch to hurry up and pull the trigger. IF THERE'S A Chuck YOU WILL KILL OFF DEAN WINCHESTER RIGHT HERE RIGHT NOW IT WOULD BE A FREAKING MERCY KILLING HURRY HURRY HURRY!!!!!!!!!! To no avail. What absolutely destroyed my rating of this particular episode was the fact that the whole thing with Dean and Mary was just so Dean could PIMP SAM! Are you kidding me? OMG, even Dean no longer recalls that he went to Hell! It really didn't happen, it never happened in DABB WORLD!!!!!! I HATE ANDREW DABB, I HATE BO BO BERENS, I HATE EVERYONE INVOLVED IN THIS SHOW! And I can't even with all the lame Sam monologues and his raging narcissism on display for everyone to see and revel in. Screw you, Sam. I saw all this described as textbook Sam fan fiction. I agree, it came off exactly like that. Could it get any worse? Glad you asked, because yes it could - see episode 23. Obviously neither Mary nor Luci are dead, more's the pity, so they're coming back. And we're likely to get more of alt!Bobby too. And Kelly's Gollum baby will either heal Castiel, and then they'll probably run off together having adventures of their own that the Winchesters aren't involved in - certainly not second-banana cape-holder sidekick Dean. Or, as fans have started to speculate, the Cas who is dead is alt!Cas for whatever reason - OR real Cas is dead, and Misha will play alt!Cas from now on. Or some variation on a theme of any of those. We'll know soon enough. The only nice thing about Castiel's temporary "death" is that Dean was allowed to be genuinely grief-stricken, FWIW.** ** I will add here that I do think there is possibly some decent potential with exploring the alt universe, especially as the storytelling on the mothership side is so creatively bankrupt. And what the hell, they may as well steal from all the CW superhero shows. But the same problem remains on this show - poor showrunning and writing that they can't overcome. And WTF was up with Dabb killing Rowena off screen? Seriously?!? That maneuver screamed bad blood behind the scenes. You don't do that to a character/actor who has been around for a few years, not even give her a single on screen scene to die in, if it's not personal. Poor Ruth. She did not deserve that, and from what I read on twitter, she doesn't seem happy about it.** **Maybe there's a chance we'll get an alt!Rowena from the other 'verse. That would be just about the only non-crappy reason for Dabb to do what he did. Lucky Mark Sheppard, though. I will not believe that Mark himself isn't at least partly responsible for killing off Crowley. There's no way he could have been happy the last couple of years with the writing for his character, and he's too good a character actor to keep wasting his time and talent on this crapfest of a show. When I saw the tear thing referred to online as the glowing vagina, I howled! And now I cannot see it any other way. LOL! That's about the only chuckle I can get out of the episode. Everything about Dabb's episode was hella stupid. I'm not sure I can even be mad about it - it's too stupid to get angry at. The only thing I'm angry about is Dabb shitting on Ruth. But there's no question in my mind anymore that Dabb has lost whatever tiny modicum of talent he may have had at one time. He really needs to give up on the writing thing and get a real day job. Unfortunately it sounds like Singer, Dabb, and the entire talentless crop of writers are all going to be back next year. Nothing will change.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 8, 2017 17:13:12 GMT -5
I also posted the news in the Carver thread, but maybe that wasn't the right place to put it.
Anyway, yeah, it's unsurprising, but does open up a possibility for SPN. Though normally once these people move on, they move on. However - and someone correct me if I'm wrong - when I was still paying attention to things like credits, or episodes in general, I always noticed that Carver was still listed in the end credits as an exec producer, or producer, one of those. Is that still true? I always thought that was a little odd, seeing as he was showrunning Frequency, and was probably unofficially gone most of season 11 too. But certainly for season 12 he shouldn't have still been attached to the show, but he was, or is if anyone here recalls the latest credits.
That made me think that Carver had a deal with the network or studio or both for the chance to return to the show if the CW didn't go forward with Frequency. And, too, maybe that's why Dabb was listed as second under Singer instead of being the primary showrunner.
So who knows?
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 8, 2017 15:47:05 GMT -5
From TVG.So now the question is if Carver will return to Supernatural.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 8, 2017 7:58:08 GMT -5
Pros- I actually thought this was one of this season's better episodes. It felt more like old school SPN, with the creepy wicker man theme. The Banes family was an interesting mirror to the Winchesters. I also didn't feel like their presence overpowered the episode, unlike some of the other guest characters. And, thank Chuck, Dean finally got a kill and proved he's not just there to prop up Sam/Cas/Mary/the wall. I was beginning to wonder. Mary actually showing a little interest in her sons was also nice. It still doesn't redeem the character in my eyes but at least it was something. Cons- yeah, killing off Alicia was just wrong. She and her brother had a lot of potential. As someone who really isn't into the whole Wayward Daughters thing, I'd really love to see some other new guest characters stick around. The whole Brits' storyline is just beyond ridiculous. The sooner it ends, the better. And I'm so, so beyond the show's idolization of Sam. Now he can fix the Colt too? Oh please. Because I heard that Dean was accidentally allowed a kill, I caved and tried to watch this one after the fact. I still ended up FF'ing through the majority of Mary Sue/Ketchup because so very bored now, and it was unfortunately the vast sum of the episode. And I can't even with Mary leaving a VM only AFTER Dean has left yet another one of the probably hundreds he's left her, as if that's supposed to show some kind of maternal concern. It doesn't, especially since we've seen this VM/text shtick before. First of all, it continues to piss me off that Dean's been reduced to pathetically groveling after this woman via phone calls and texts all season long. Dean, I love you more than cake, but I'd rather see your head cut off your body than watch you continue to be such a fucking loser. Get over it - she's just not that into you, and more than that, she doesn't deserve you anyway. And following that point, seriously, does Dabb honestly think if he does kill off Mary - and that would only come about because much of the audience is just not that into her - that many viewers would even care? She has spent almost the entire season separated from the brothers, so the emotional attachment simply isn't there. Yes, that's what Dabb and Sam Smith wanted, but it came with a price - the one where many fans either dislike her or simply don't care about her because she hasn't been a part of the Winchesters' world. Mary is a completely separate storyline, bottom line. So I can't give this episode more than a 3-4/10 because the Mary Sue/Ketchup stuff drags it down for me. OTOH, a 3-4 is pretty generous on my part for almost any episode this year. This season is such a crapfest. Still, if the episode was predominantly the Winchesters and the witch twins, I would have rated it higher. All that being said, I do agree that despite the fact that I honestly couldn't recall the "twins" after the hunter funeral episode, as characters in this particular episode they finally stood out and were pretty cool. So naturally that meant at least one of them had to die (RME!) - in this case really two of them counting the mom, who was also cool and SO MUCH BETTER than the Winchesters' mother. Isn't it Alicia who even says something along those lines to Dean, throws a diss at Mary? I don't know how that got past Dabb either, but I liked hearing it. So a point just for that line. Of course, that's probably also why she was killed off. The wickerman theme was creepy for a change, since sadly legit creepiness or horror is so very rare with this show now. Not sure I understood the different kind of demon deal that old witch/woman made - where was the 10 year contract? - but screwing up old canon is weekly par for the course. And while it was so nice and generous - RME!!!!!!!! - to allow Dean the kill this week, it still was rather blah given how he was passively placed in a chair for the entire scene, so not exactly badass. And then there is the obvious Sam/JP checklist demand that is still in play whereby Sam and ONLY Sam is allowed to know how to fix anything or pick a lock - things Dean used to be able to do but isn't allowed to do anymore - topped off with the added moldy cherry of the iconic Dean line about Dad being on a hunt now rewritten, as so many things have been over the years, just so Sam can say or do them. I don't even see Sam anymore, he's a ghost, nonexistent as far as I'm concerned. Like I already said once on this board, I really only see JP's agent or Dabb's Sam-checklist on screen. In fact, I saw on another board where someone speculated that this episode may have been shot when JP's latest kid was born. I don't know if the timing works out, but if that's true, then that's probably the reason Dean was allowed the kill this week, because they had to give JP some time off. So witch twins good, their (sadly) dead mom good, wickerman plot moderately interesting, Dean was allowed a kill even if it was a passive one. I'll split the difference for a 3.5/10
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 4, 2017 5:48:56 GMT -5
Dabb's increasingly hard-to-ignore backlash against the character of Dean Winchester is so relentless and checklist-specific that it's almost impossible to believe anymore that Dabb doesn't really hate the character and/or has no love for the actor playing him. If that's not what's going on, he's got a terrible way of showing his respect.
Otherwise, seriously, that's a lot of hate-on for a fictional construct, so maybe someone needs to inform Andrew Dabb that Dean Winchester doesn't actually exist! There are other people and things in the world that deserve his ire a lot more than someone pretend.
Honestly it looks to me like Dabb, who clearly doesn't have permission to fire Jensen, is trying to force him to ask to break his contract. Unfortunately, for Jensen's fans, he won't do that, so this empty shell of a character is what we're left with.
The other problem is that he's doing Sam no favors with this bullshit. I mean, I don't even see Sam anymore - that character doesn't exist either. All I see on screen is JP's agent wearing a suit made out of JP's contract. And all that does is piss me off.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on May 2, 2017 9:47:59 GMT -5
WGA strike averted.Lots of articles popping up, just grabbed one of them. So, no much-needed breathing room for Supernatural. On the plus side, we won't lose the late night comedy pundits that are sorely needed in this turbulent time.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on Apr 30, 2017 8:02:13 GMT -5
My wish list: 1. Return Dean to his old self. Enough Valium!Sidekick!Dean. This is actually my biggest sticking point. I could've made peace with the rest of this trainwreck of a season if we'd gotten enough badass hunter/leader Dean. 2. Balance out the hunting skill between the brothers. If Sam does most of the research for a case, let Dean come up with the plan. If Sam gets a kill and saves the day in one episode, Dean should get to do the same in the next. 3. Stop Sue-ing up Sam. That's always been a problem for showrunners but this season has really been OTT. 4. Bring back emotional resonance to the show (ie, have storylines that directly involves the brothers; bring back a strong single character POV; allow both brothers to bond with guest stars.) This season has just felt....flat. 5. Stop making Cas into a woobie idjit and put him firmly on the side of the Winchesters. 6. Either have Mary develop some sort of maternal warmth towards her sons or let her go back to Heaven. I don't care that she's Super Huntress Alpha Mary. Eileen can be that. Mary has a special designation on the show as the boys' mother. If Dabb's that much against Mary even making the brothers an occasional sandwich and giving them a warm hug, then, as far as I'm concerned, there's really no point to her being on the show... Quoting most of paro's post because she's saying it all for me. I just cut it down a little so the quote wouldn't be so long. But I agree with every point, especially #1 and #6. My overwhelming demand is for Dean Winchester to return to the show. Period. Not this cardboard cut-out that has been masquerading as Dean Winchester, when it's on screen at all. Without a fully-realized Dean Winchester, I can't love the show, the story, or any of the other characters. I don't give a damn about Dabb's personal preferences or beefs or whatever his high-school'ish problem is with Dean or Jensen. He needs to grow up and get over it - he has a job to do and two lead characters and actors, and pretending otherwise doesn't make it so. Hey, don't like Jensen, don't like Dean - then fire Jensen. Please. It's happened on other shows before. But nobody will fire Jensen to get him out of the way. Why, because they can't? Because the CW and WB know that there's no show or audience at all without him? Well, they're getting proof of that now as the audience is starting to walk away. The writing staff is spending more time trying to downplay or virtually eliminate Dean from the scripts than they are just trying to write a good story - and, again, it shows, badly. Dabb would rather all the regular characters get out of the way so he can create a spin-off while not having to do the work of actually coming up with an original project and selling it to a network. Boo-hoo, lazy baby. Can't do the job because you're not interested in the characters in this 'verse? Then walk away! So, yes, I think the show needs a showrunner who likes the characters - all of them, including Dean - and wants to portray them as best as he/she can, and knows they need to be the most integral parts of any storyline in this 'verse for that storyline to sell to the audience.
|
|
|
Post by paforrest on Apr 28, 2017 11:16:42 GMT -5
|
|